Hi Jochen Szangolies

You said nicely 'Among them is the problem of fundamentals: since every model of the world reduces to some set of fundamental facts, we expect the same thing to hold of the world as a whole. This, however, ultimately confuses the map with the territory.' And about the Mirror test..." it's certainly not necessary to be able to pass that test in order to have a sense of self, but I'm merely taking it the other way around---that having some idea of what 'you' are is necessary to pass the mirror test. Because by passing that test, a child, or ape, or bird essentially says 'that's me'; so there needs to be an idea of 'me' beforehand." You went into philosophy.... dear Jochen Szangolies.............. very nice idea....

I highly appreciate your essay and hope and request you please spend some of the valuable time on Dynamic Universe Model also and give your some of the valuable & esteemed guidance

Some of the Main foundational points of Dynamic Universe Model :

-No Isotropy

-No Homogeneity

-No Space-time continuum

-Non-uniform density of matter, universe is lumpy

-No singularities

-No collisions between bodies

-No blackholes

-No warm holes

-No Bigbang

-No repulsion between distant Galaxies

-Non-empty Universe

-No imaginary or negative time axis

-No imaginary X, Y, Z axes

-No differential and Integral Equations mathematically

-No General Relativity and Model does not reduce to GR on any condition

-No Creation of matter like Bigbang or steady-state models

-No many mini Bigbangs

-No Missing Mass / Dark matter

-No Dark energy

-No Bigbang generated CMB detected

-No Multi-verses

Here:

-Accelerating Expanding universe with 33% Blue shifted Galaxies

-Newton's Gravitation law works everywhere in the same way

-All bodies dynamically moving

-All bodies move in dynamic Equilibrium

-Closed universe model no light or bodies will go away from universe

-Single Universe no baby universes

-Time is linear as observed on earth, moving forward only

-Independent x,y,z coordinate axes and Time axis no interdependencies between axes..

-UGF (Universal Gravitational Force) calculated on every point-mass

-Tensors (Linear) used for giving UNIQUE solutions for each time step

-Uses everyday physics as achievable by engineering

-21000 linear equations are used in an Excel sheet

-Computerized calculations uses 16 decimal digit accuracy

-Data mining and data warehousing techniques are used for data extraction from large amounts of data.

- Many predictions of Dynamic Universe Model came true....Have a look at

http://vaksdynamicuniversemodel.blogspot.in/p/blog-page_15.html

I request you to please have a look at my essay also, and give some of your esteemed criticism for your information........

Dynamic Universe Model says that the energy in the form of electromagnetic radiation passing grazingly near any gravitating mass changes its in frequency and finally will convert into neutrinos (mass). We all know that there is no experiment or quest in this direction. Energy conversion happens from mass to energy with the famous E=mC2, the other side of this conversion was not thought off. This is a new fundamental prediction by Dynamic Universe Model, a foundational quest in the area of Astrophysics and Cosmology.

In accordance with Dynamic Universe Model frequency shift happens on both the sides of spectrum when any electromagnetic radiation passes grazingly near gravitating mass. With this new verification, we will open a new frontier that will unlock a way for formation of the basis for continual Nucleosynthesis (continuous formation of elements) in our Universe. Amount of frequency shift will depend on relative velocity difference. All the papers of author can be downloaded from "http://vaksdynamicuniversemodel.blogspot.in/ "

I request you to please post your reply in my essay also, so that I can get an intimation that you replied

Best

=snp

    Dear Eckard,

    the details of DQC1 are, of course, completely public---see for instance the publications here and https://arxiv.org/abs/0709.0548.

    The problem considered in DQC1 (Deterministic Quantum Computation with One pure qubit) is the evaluation of the (normalized) trace of a unitary matrix. This is generally believed to be hard classically, but a quantum algorithm can be formulated that provides an estimate in a number of trials that does not scale exponentially. The algorithm's answer is obtained by Pauli measurements on a single qubit whose state is separable from those upon which the unitary acts. Consequently, there's no entanglement present.

    However, there is another kind of quantum correlation, known as quantum discord, that is often postulated to be the reason behind this algorithm's advantage over classical resources. Discord involves quantum states that are probabilistic mixtures of 'pure' quantum states; only such mixtures serve as 'resource' states for DQC1.

    But all of this is still very much an open area of research. Still, it's an exciting idea!

    Dear Peter,

    thanks for your kind comments. I'm not sure why you think that my QM background is at odds with the themes of my essay---quite to the contrary, I think it is my background there that opened up the possibility of viewing the world rather as covered by perhaps even superficially inconsistent pictures, rather than as being wholly cut from the same marble (because of the notion of complementarity).

    I will try and have a look at your essay---although one cautionary note upfront is that I think it's generally not a good idea to try and produce a classical explanation for CHSH > 2, since that's easily done via data-rejection, timing issues, or similar such tricks. In my opinion, you should instead focus your efforts on inequalities that take only actually observed events into consideration, such as the Clauser-Horne one. But more on that probably later.

    Hi Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta,

    thanks for your comment and your appreciation. I'll try to have a look at your essay, but I can't promise I'll find something interesting to say. I will have a look, though.

    (Sorry for just copy-pasting your name, I was unsure which address to use.)

    Dear Francesco,

    thanks for your comment! I'll have a look at your essay, 'absolute relativism' is a nice turn of phrase and indicates that you're already aware of the main problems relativist approaches face---as phrased by Connor Oberst, "if you swear that there's/ no truth, and who cares/ how come you say it,/ like you're right". (But that just as a diversion.)

    Regarding my definition of information, I essentially appeal to algorithmic information theory---there, the information content of an object is defined by the shortest program necessary in order to make a computer output that object (or a description of it). So a string like 'aaaaaaa....a' can be reduced to 'na', where n is an integer, while a jumble of random characters in generally can't be reduced much.

    This captures the intuition that information content ought to have something to do with the redundancy in some object: what is highly redundant can't tell you anything new, and thus, contains little information; if there is little redundancy, however, there's new information at each step. In other words, low-information objects can be highly compressed, high-information objects have little room for compression.

    Does that help clear things up?

    Dear Jochen,

    thank you very much, you was very clear. I found your essay very interesting and I wish you luck!

    (Yes, my text is an attempt to handle that paradox, I hope it will interest you).

    All the best,

    Francesco

    @All, I'm sorry if I'm a bit tardy in my replies---work has been keeping me a little busy lately. This should clear up in February, though, so I hope to be quicker with my answers then.

    In the meantime, why don't you have a look at the discussion of my essay over at the fantastic blog on all things consciousness, Conscious Entities where Peter Hankins provides his insightful commentary on the issues I discuss in the essay!

      Jochen,

      "covered by perhaps even superficially inconsistent pictures" Yes, right on.

      also "inequalities that take only actually observed events into consideration" agree entirely, you'll see that's what I've done. (But of course it must still give CHSH>2).

      I actually model the interaction events physically at a larger scale and reveal a classical natural 'complementarity' hidden within 'OAM' itself, so QM's starting assumptions need a slight change (to match Maxwell's inclusion of 'curl'). All experimental outcomes then follow classically. Yes I know that sound ridiculous after 100 years but it's none the less true. The full ontology and (slightly complex in 3D) process and protocol are given, with a short video to assist.

      I'd greatly value you studying the model carefully and analysing/discussing. It seems few really understand QM and most that do are sold on nature being weird. Are you familiar with John Bells rather ignored views & comments that a classical description must exist? (around p172-5 I recall - quote on request)

      Very best

      Peter

      Hi Jochen,

      I liked your essay very much. And I love the Tao Te Ching. It helps to widen our imagination of the world.

      So allow me to make one sceptical remark: Do you really belief the various incompleteness theorems are an indication (or prove?) for the existence of something beyond our modelling capacity? Sometimes I hope so. And sometimes I'm sceptical. Let me try to formulate my scepticism:

      Your model in figure 1 seem to me to assume a realistic world view in the sense, that the object is independent of the model. This makes the entities (object, model) together build a new object, that can be modelled, and that is bigger, than the original object. This is analog to Thomas Breuer's "The impossibility of accurate state self-measurements". A system wants to measure an object with n properties. Let us say, that the the measurement system needs n properties itself to distinguish these n properties. So together system and object have n^2 possible properties (possible states). More than the system can measure. So a system within the total can never have the full information. Is this at the root quantum complementarity?

      Not so sure. In classical systems with symmetries for instance only the relative distance is measurable. So if the object has a location x (like a property) and the measurement system has location y. Only the distance (x-y) has a physical significance. The domain of the distances is of the same range as the properties of the measurement system. So classical systems seems to work very well although it seemed we had some incompleteness here. And no wonder classical physics worked so well for many years.

      Finally let me say that your argument with the Mary case is beautiful.

      Regards,

      Luca

        Hi Luca,

        thanks for your nice comments (in particular in regard to the Mary's room argument)! As for your skepticism, I think there's many different ways of approaching this question. One, for instance, is that I think Gödel's two incompleteness theorems establish a limitation of the human capacity to formalize mathematics, not a limitation on mathematics itself, as it's usually phrased---in other words, it's not that 'mathematics is incomplete', but rather, that the axiom systems human mathematicians can formulate---being necessarily finitely specifiable, effective, and so on, which ultimately boils down to being computable---don't suffice to capture all of mathematics.

        But to say that this implies the existence of something beyond our modeling capacity would require a belief in the preexistence of mathematical objects, i.e. some form of Platonism---which is not something I myself would be willing to commit to.

        But things get clearer once one things instead of abstract formal systems in terms of computers. The halting problem is an instance of the same phenomenon that also gives rise to incompleteness (Lawvere's fixed-point theorem, which Noson Yanofsky, who also has an entry in this contest, discusses in a very accessible way here), and the two are equivalent in some ways. Now, with the math we know how to use, we can't in general predict whether a given TM halts; nevertheless, one might justifiably hold that there's still a fact of the matter regarding whether it will or won't. But Turing machines are themselves abstract entities, and would require an infinite tape or something equivalent to build; so again, it's not immediately clear if that has any real-world significance.

        So let's now turn to physics. You mention Breuer's results, which I think are very interesting; but there's many more indications of a connection between QM and logical independence (in fact, John Wheeler managed to get himself thrown out of Gödel's office for suggesting a connection). For instance, Caslav Brukner and colleagues could show that if they encode a set of axioms into a quantum state, measurements related to propositions that are not derivable from those axioms yield a random outcome. However, this is not specific to Gödel's incompleteness, as the axiom systems were too simple for Gödel's construction to apply---Gödel's theorems then simply mean that such phenomena never 'go away', so to speak.

        A more qualitative line of reasoning is the following: you can represent any non-computable function with a computation plus a source of randomness; consequently, if we are beings using computational methods to model a non-computable world, we should expect the world to look like a computation with intermittent random events. That's of course exactly what we have in QM. An obvious counterexample here might seem to be Bohmian mechanics: but actually, it turns out that a model that reproduces quantum mechanics by introducing nonlocal influences (as BM does) cannot be computable---otherwise, one could use these influences to transmit information, contradicting the tenets of special relativity.

        There are many more results pointing in a similar direction scattered about the literature (and of course, there's my own argument that I cite in the essay); but I think it's as yet unclear what the picture is they paint. Zwick in the 1970s, and later on Peres and Zurek, proposed that QM's "inability to completely describe the measurement process appears to be not a flaw of the theory but a logical necessity which is analogous to Gödel's undecidability theorem". I think that it's again as with the incompleteness theorems in mathematics: they're not a limitation on mathematics itself, but on human mathematicians; likewise, the limitation we see is not one on physics, but on physicists: using computable models, which we must if I'm right, to model a non-computable world, will inevitable lead to something like a quantum description.

        But this is an argument that needs to be made much more carefully, and which I'm in the agonizingly slow process of working out. We'll see what comes of it!

        Dear Fellow Essayists

        This will be my final plea for fair treatment.,

        Reliable evidence exists that proves that the surface of the earth was formed millions of years before man and his utterly complex finite informational systems ever appeared on that surface. It logically follows that Nature must have permanently devised the only single physical construct of earth allowable.

        All objects, be they solid, liquid, or vaporous have always had a visible surface. This is because the real Universe must consist only of one single unified VISIBLE infinite surface occurring eternally in one single infinite dimension that am always illuminated mostly by finite non-surface light.

        Only the truth can set you free.

        Joe Fisher, Realist

        Thank you Jochen for the details. Admittedly I don't feel in position to comment on them.

        The more I wonder why FQXi decided not to immediately show this key posting of you.

        Regards,

        Eckard

        Dear Jochen,

        Your essay is very beautiful! My compliments.

        My starting point in my essay is somewhat similar to yours - emergence of self-awareness as crossing of a critical threshold during evolution. But then I drifted off in a different direction :-)

        My best wishes for your success in this contest.

        Tejinder

          Dear Jochen - fantastic essay! Beautifully written and very interesting!

          It also seems to me we have a large overlap in our ideas: What you call "a world without models" is pretty similar to what I call "a fundamental Universe".

          There are two important differences, though:

          1) It seems to me that for you the different "models" (what I call "realities") are equally fundamental. This would allow for strong emergence, though, which I believe can be no part of any sensible, scientific world view. What is your stance on this issue?

          2) I'm more optimistic about the limitations of science. So I would not a priori agree that no model can reflect the world as it is. Wouldn't you agree that by the fact you are able to speculate about the "world without models" you are already creating an (albeit very imperfect, of course) model of this fundamental reality? It depends on what you mean by "reflect", I guess.

          (You might be in line here with philosopher Markus Gabriel who claims that the world does not exist, though).

          Apart from that, while I agree that consciousness, memory and "conceiving of oneself as separated from the world" are closely related (my last year's entry in collaboration with psychologist Marc Wittmann discussed exactly this issue - they are not the same. For example, the problem of the sphex wasp seems to be mainly due to a limited memory and not so much due to a lack of consciousness or a lack of concept of being separated from the world. As I'm very interested in these topics, can you elaborate a little more or hint me towards some literature here?

          Btw, I noticed you got your PhD from Düsseldorf. Are you still based in Germany?

          Best regards from Dortmund! Heinrich

            I enjoyed going through with some ease with your contribution. Classical analogs are what makes the predictons of Quantum Mechanics relate we humans with our daily life experiences. To me QM is struggling to evolve still as it is attempting to tackle Gravity! It is called the weak force but it is the force that keeps our Universe together, not that much the other three force fields that deal better with microscopic world mainly.When we were being taught this subject over 60 years back at Delhi University, our good teacher used to cite hermits and their humble abode. He got his doctorate in Germany. I too have visited your country mainly as a tourist and found how much you love beer and food that accompanies the drinks.

            May i request you to clarify if we can treat QM as a full fledged theory like the classical Physics. To me, QM has been truly a life of an hermit who lives in a humble home nearer a forest rather than a city or township! It has not satisfied Albert Einstein though he was one of the founder. He was reluctant to begin with and then continued to keep that spirit till his end!

              Dear Tejinder,

              thanks for your kind words! I'll have a look at what you're doing with the 'phase transition'-imagery. In some ways, I wonder if one couldn't develop that metaphor in a more rigorous way---Tegmark, of course, has already proclaimed consciousness to be a 'state of matter'. So perhaps we're just one early pocket of self-awareness percolating in a universe about to transform. Ah well, that might make a good plot for a science fiction story, at least...

              Dear Heinrich,

              thanks for your interesting comments! I'll have to have a look at your 'fundamental universe'. And you're right, I did read Gabriel's "Warum es die Welt nicht gibt" exactly because I also perceived some kinship in his ideas, but found it ultimately rather disappointing.

              Regarding models and strong emergence, well, it depends what stance you take. The traditional view would be that models possess some immediate correspondence with the things they model, at least up to some suitable approximation, and that thus we should consider the entities they posit, and the explanations they provide, as giving us some insight into what really goes on in the world. Here, I think, strong emergence is troubling: in some sense, there would be certain things that violate Leibniz' principle of sufficient reason---facts about the world that would obtain without any answer to the question of why they should.

              In some sense, though, this is also true in classical reductionist ideas---after all, if everything can be reduced to some set of base facts, then those facts themselves admit no further justification. From this point of view, strong emergence maybe doesn't seem that much worse---it merely adds additional 'fundamental' facts that obtain at some higher level of coarse-graining, for instance.

              But in my view, all models are inaccurate to some degree---every model is incomplete by necessity, just as all axiomatic systems (of sufficient power) are. The world admits no more of a single model than mathematics admits of a single axiom system.

              Are then facts that fail to fall under the purview of a given model strongly emergent? From the point of the view of the model, you might say so: after all, within that model, there is no way of reducing them to fundamental facts; they're true for no reason.

              But this tells us something about the model, in my opinion, not something about the world. In other words, it's our problem, not that of the world---just as the fact that there is no single axiom system for all of mathematics ultimately may be considered a limitation of human mathematicians; if we weren't limited to finitely specifiable, effective systems, these problems wouldn't exist. So I think that if my thoughts entail strong emergence in some sense, then one also should think that mathematics contains strong emergence. But then it seems to me that's just fine, after all, mathematicians have still been able to make great strides in mathematical understanding post Gödel. (In that manner I, too, am optimistic about the progress of science---our understanding of the world will continually increase, but I don't think it will come to a true end point, although for all practical purposes, it eventually may.)

              (By the way, have you seen Sabine Hossenfelder's take on strong emergence in this contest? I think it's a clever idea, although ultimately, I don't believe it really buys the necessary elbow room for things like free will.)

              You're right also to point out the difference between consciousness, the sense of self, and so on. I wasn't intending to suggest an equivalence here, but I think there is a sort of progression---in order to be properly called 'conscious', you need to have a sense of self, and in order to have that, you need to be able to conceive of yourself as an entity distinct from the rest of the world, and in order to do so, you need to be able to model the world as sort of a container with you in it. Each lower rung is necessary, but not sufficient, for the next one. (As for literature on the subject of consciousness, I can't really claim to be an expert, but if you haven't read it, I still think that Jaegwon Kim's 'Philosophy of Mind' is one of the best overviews of the subject, and contains many references for further digging into the topics you find particularly interesting.)

              There's also an issue regarding what constitutes a model that you highlight. In some sense, a brick is a model for our solar system---we could use it, say, in a model of the nearest couple of star systems. That empty beer bottle over there is Alpha Centauri, the football is Epsilon Eridani, and so on.

              Undoubtedly, however, it would make for a very bad model of the solar system. That's because only its most elementary structure---the quantity, its being 'one thing'---is represented. So it's not clear in how far my talk about 'the world without models' is itself something of a model.

              In particular, one also may talk about 'the round square cupola of Berkeley college', but does that necessitate a model of it? Can one model impossible objects? I think that one instead has models of its parts, or understands its properties individually, without really being able to put things together---so one knows (by model) what 'round' means, what 'square' means, what 'cupola' means and so on; but one can't really put these together, since that would be an impossible object. I think one understands 'the world without models' in a similar way.

              Grüße zurück aus Köln,

              Jochen

              Dear Narendra,

              thanks for your comment. My essay isn't really all that concerned with quantum mechanics, but regarding your question, well, it depends. QM is certainly a different kind of theory than classical mechanics---after all, it generally can only give probabilistic predictions, while classical mechanics comes with a (to some) reassuring certainty (at least in principle).

              But that doesn't mean it's not a full fledged theory. If by this you mean a mathematical apparatus, and a way to connect the mathematics with observation (sometimes called the 'minimal interpretation' that makes the difference between physical theories and purely mathematical frameworks), then QM is just as reputable a theory as classical mechanics.

              If you want further to know 'what it all means', however, quantum mechanics seems much less amenable to intuition. But is that the fault of the theory, or of the human mind that isn't used to it? I don't have an answer.

              Dr Szangolies,

              While I admit that your title scared the bejeebers out of me, I really liked your essay! Then I noticed that you are information theorist, which likely helps explain why I so many of your points resonated well with me.[1]

              Your points about the unavoidable incompleteness of our models is dead on, and also the tip of a fascinating and huge iceberg of related points. Life itself has a huge incentive to make those models as effective as possible, and the universe has this peculiar habit of lumping together at multiple scales (nuclei, atoms, molecules, "blobby molecular thingies" (viruses up to blue whales), planets, all of which can be modeled more effectively because "at a distance" the require fewer bits to model.[2]

              Your conclusion is good and interesting, though I do think your lead up provides an opportunity for an even strong ending. If you think about the history of modeling, and in particular modeling in topics such as physics, the very act of trying to build necessarily incomplete models has force people to look for special rules that help overcome that incompleteness by applying to an exceptionally large number of situations. That in turn helped create the suite of modeling tools, such as mathematics, that in turn seem to connect us more deeply with the "whatever it is" in the universe that makes it work uniformly and predictable.

              In other words, the constraints imposed by having to use incomplete models seems to help filter out and clarify rules that are in some sense more fundamental. I think your argument heads in that direction, and helps make that overall point, even if not explicitly.

              So again, thanks for a great essay that was fun to read and makes some deep points.

              Cheers,

              Terry Bollinger

              ---------------------

              [1] My own essay. "Fundamental as Fewer Bits" (topic 3099) is centered around the Kolmogorov variant of information theory.

              [2] Henry W. Lin, Max Tegmark, David Rolnick. Why does deep and cheap learning work so well? (on arXiv) See the sections on renormalization and scaling.

                Dear Jochen Szangolies

                Just letting you know that I am making a start on reading of your essay, and hope that you might also take a glance over mine please? I look forward to the sharing of thoughtful opinion. Congratulations on your essay rating as it stands, and best of luck for the contest conclusion.

                My essay is titled

                "Darwinian Universal Fundamental Origin". It stands as a novel test for whether a natural organisational principle can serve a rationale, for emergence of complex systems of physics and cosmology. I will be interested to have my effort judged on both the basis of prospect and of novelty.

                Thank you & kind regards

                Steven Andresen