• Ultimate Reality
  • Classical Spheres, Division Algebras, and the Illusion of Quantum Non-locality:

  • [deleted]

I am sorry you found reading my work a nuisance, but I thank you for reading it in any case.

"...the latter space is compact, while the former is not."

Indeed ... my point is as trivial as that, and I have said precisely that in one of my previous "pamphlets" (see especially my talk posted on this site). But this simple point was not understood by some, prompting me to add a figure to explain the issue.

Now I have reread my sentence you have quoted, and I do not see how anyone can infer what you are inferring from it. My sentence is correct as it stands, and within the context of my paragraph it makes perfect sense. I will let the reader decide who is in error here.

In any case, it is perfectly clear from my discussion in that paragraph that the type of functions proposed by Bell are simply not capable of accounting for all possible measurement results, and hence Bell's argument does not even get off the ground.

  • [deleted]

For example I have invented a new universal equation between all physical spheres.(quant.and cosm.)

m mass V volume v1 vel.spin.of rot. v2 vel.orb.of rot. more the others rotations of the system......if you take these elements you have an universal constant....mvV= CONSTANT.............now of course all that is in 3D for the respect of our proportionalities of evolution, the SPHERIZATION OF QUANTUM SPHERES ....COSMOLOGICAL SPHERES ...INSIDE A BEAUTIFUL 3D SPHERE IN OPTIMIZATION TOWARDS THE PERFECT HARMONY BETWEEN ALL THESE SPHEERS AND LIFES AND COSCIOUSNESS.....LOGIC DEAR SCIENTISTS LOGIC......THE OCTONION AND THE QUATERNION ARE UNDER THE LAWS OF THE SPHERE!!!!!!!

Regards

Steve

  • [deleted]

I think the sentence that you seem to be confused about is quite clear. No logical inference intended, so if you choose to read it differently that is simply an error on your part.

  • [deleted]

Thanks. You have confirmed what I assumed to be the case - the simple inertia of introducing new ideas into the system. There must be a strong desire to keep hold of spookiness - it makes good stories.

However, I would have hoped that your work at Oxford Uni and the Perimiter Institute would have acorded you a little more respect than having to respond to the charges of 'fantastical ideas' below. It is hard to understand how adding a few extra dimensions to balance Bell's equation is unfavourably compared with instantaneous action at a distance.

Hopefully more people will simply read the paper for what it is, and appreciate the problem it attempts to solve. Hope you don't have to wait as long as Grete.

  • [deleted]

Dear Dr Christian,

I am a bit confused regarding your critique of Bell's theorem. While I don't claim to understand your work in detail, it appears on first sight that you allow geometries that not necessarily approximate flat metric, or any metric at all, on small scales. You bring the example of a torsion tensor, and - unless I am mistaken - one could also mention some noncommutative geometry as another example. Doesn't that mean that your work begins on a somewhat different premise as compared to conventional formulation in physics would? It appears to me that giving up "metric" as central concept to guarantee universal applicability of physical law, that indeed there will be far reaching consequences. That would make your work a very interesting opportunity for restricting validity of Bell's theorem to incomplete subspaces of a more general, "complete" geometry of nature. Am I off?

Thanks, Jens

    • [deleted]

    Dear Dr. Koeplinger,

    Thank you for your comments. I am not doing anything unconventional in my work, apart from correcting the incorrect topology of the co-domain of the local-realistic functions presumed by Bell. This change has nothing to do with the spacetime geometry, or the geometry of the quantum state space. It only amounts to completing the space of all possible measurement results, in the EPR sense, within the orthodox local-realistic framework of Bell. So, I am afraid, you are indeed "off."

    J.C.

    • [deleted]

    Thank you for responding so quickly! I'll have to study this and your work a bit.

    There's one more thing I'd like to ask: You mention Sir Atiyah's talk from Simons Center last year. Many people wonder about it, as do I; but beyond the slides I couldn't even find the reference list ... Since you're hinting at it, I thought I'd ask what you're referring to when you wrote about specific steps and substantiated ideas. Sorry for the indiscretion :)

    Thanks, Jens

    (no Dr/PhD)

    • [deleted]

    Jens,

    I myself was not present at Atiyah's talk and know about its contents only through secondary sources. I have written to him directly and perhaps he will respond (although he is an extraordinarily busy man, as you can imagine). Beyond that I rather not go into details about his talk, because the last thing I want to do is to misrepresent his carefully thought-out argument.

    Joy

    • [deleted]

    ok, thank you, I'll stay tuned. Jens

    Joy

    Excellent, brilliant and honest, thank you. Physics needs more prepared to let go of old myth and nonsense and develop their brains properly.

    I don't pretend to follow much of the maths, but I'm among 3 who have found the same conclusion, all from slightly different routes, with essays in the current competition. It really arose from the string posts under the essays. My own is entirely logic based and maths free http://fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/803 '2020 Vision' but you'll also want to read at least Edwin Klingsman and Willards essays. Edwin is an ex NASA research scientist and handy with sums, Willards appraoch is philosophical, mine is very Reality/Locality, showing how bells inequity is completely sidelined by a local reality that should keep Roger P happy by producing his Holy Grail of giving SR a (non spooky) quantum mechanism to run it.

    I would be delighted if you'd comment. The solution has also opened up many other previously obscured areas of science, and I'd like to cite your paper in the one I'm just finishing deriving a real galactic secular evolution sequence, which is quite dramatic stuff. I hope you can understand my language!

    We really must start a movement to clear physics of troglodytes to let it catch up one day!

    Thank you again.

    Very best wishes

    Peter

    Joy Christian,

    First, let me say, you have a beautiful name.

    You also have a beautiful mind. I've well over a dozen QM text books, all of which I have studied to some degree, and, in a few pages of '...the Illusion of Entanglement' you've clarified things that have confused me for decades.

    Thank you.

    Since my theory presumes local realism, with a particle plus pilot-wave, I've encountered rejection based on entanglement issues that you treat so well. If you succeed in rescuing physics from this illusion, we will all be indebted to you.

    Best of luck to you.

    Edwin Eugene Klingman

    A slight correction. I said we'll all be indebted to you. Not quite so. As Tolstoy said:

    "I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their lives."

    Being an expert on 'spooky' and 'weird' quantum mechanics is fun. To have to retract all the fascinating things, said to so many rapt audiences is no fun. And will probably be resisted to the grave.

    Edwin Eugene Klingman

    • [deleted]

    Thank you for your kind words. The person who rescued us from the illusion of entanglement was Einstein, not me. My aim is to simply demonstrate that Bell's theorem does not undermine Einstein's position, because the theorem is simply wrong. To be sure, Bell's argument is very simple and convincing at first sight, not to mention instructive, and for these reasons it will continue to appeal to many people.

    The key to understanding Bell's error is to recognize that his very first equation is not as innocent as it seems. It smuggles-in incompleteness in the accounting of measurement results from the start, by oversimplifying the topology of the measurement events. His argument thus commits to a classic error of circularity in logic, by *not* satisfying the completeness criterion of EPR. This is not easy to see, however, and has led many brilliant minds in physics astray.

    • [deleted]

    Dear Joy Christian,

    your papers are very technical, so i have to ask explicitely my question here.

    Does your arguments refuting Bell's theorem rely on the fact that for example in the EPR-Bohm experiment the two particles are "born" out of the same source and with properties that depend on the conservation of spin?

      • [deleted]

      No.

      • [deleted]

      Dear Joy Christian,

      thank you for your quick response that lead me to another question.

      If there's no dependence between the two EPR-Bohm particles and their subsequently measurements, shouldn't we observe the same statistics also with "unentangled" particles? The latter could be conducted via 2 EPR-Bohm sources, the first source emitting particles 1 and 2, the second source emitting particles 3 and 4. Particles 2 and 4 fly northwards, the particles 1 and 3 fly southwards and are measured in the same fashion like in the original EPR-Bohm setup.

      What's the reason according to your hypothesis that this experiment will output a different statistics than the original EPR-Bohm setup?

      • [deleted]

      Regardless of my work, the difference between the two scenarios you describe---the standard scenario and the un-entangled or product-state scenario---is what Bell calls the existence of a "common cause." In any local realistic theory the standard EPR-Bohm systems do what they do because there has been a common cause linking them (i.e., they have interacted in the past). This common cause is also known as "a complete state" or "a hidden variable." Within my model this common cause is the handedness of the physical space within which the EPR-Bohm experiment takes place. It is represented by a trivector mu, which is a non-trivial geometric object, and provides a pre-established harmony among the remote observations. For the un-entangled scenario you describe there would be no common handedness of the physical space for each run of the experiment (no common mu), and hence there would be no correlations among the remote observations.

      • [deleted]

      Dear Joy Christian,

      thank you for your reply.

      I ask myself if it could be possible to superpose the particles 2 and 4 (for example by a Mach-Zehnder-Interferometer or a similar setup) of my example and therefore force the particles 1 and 3 to be "entangled" and hence to reproduce the results of the standard scenario.

      Does quantum mechanics allow such a kind of "entanglement" (i do ask because i am not firm enough with the QM-Maths to deduce this question by myself)? I suppose that due to your hypothesis, this scenario wouldn't be possible, but what does QM say to such an experiment?

      • [deleted]

      My local-realistic framework reproduces quantum mechanical expectation values (at least in principle) for all conceivable physical scenarios.

      As for your question about what quantum mechanics would predict for your thought experiment, this is not the right forum for such a basic question. I suggest you first learn quantum mechanics elsewhere before trying to understand Bell's theorem or my work.

      • [deleted]

      Dear Joy,

      Edwin Eugene Klingman just made me aware of your post here. This is very exciting because I followed your archive papers and I would love to debate them with you. I need to understand 1101.1958 first, though.

      As a disclaimer, I found the prior papers incomplete in their arguments, and on the recent comments, I am very skeptical about octonions and QM because of their lack of associativity. However, this all is very thought provoking and I really look forward to studying your paper in detail and asking you questions about it.