• [deleted]

Karl,

Thanks very much for reading and commenting.

It would probably take at least another complete essay to argue against an entirely "it from bit" picture, so I can't really do the discussion justice, but I'll try nevertheless.

I certainly agree that information theory has a role to play in any new unified theory. Indeed, as I argue in the essay, in any theory where we admit we have less then perfect knowledge of the state, information theory actually must play a role. This is true whether that limited knowledge is due to the classical uncertainty in initial conditions on dice throws, the more metaphysical uncertainty offered by the Copenhagen interpretation, or as a result of impossibility of knowing the full state of field of infinite extent as I suggest. However, I think we can take "it from bit" seriously without taking it to excess. I would suggest that an entirely informational viewpoint becomes unavoidably solipsist. Solipsism may well be valid, but "solipsist physicist" is probably an oxymoron, so it is probably fair to avoid it for now if we can. I also am not convinced that objects are necessarily emergent from information theory: you may give me a stream of numbers from 1 to 6, and I may construct a predictive theory using information theory principles, but I contend that dice will not be emergent, any more than roulette wheels would be. I do not agree that a "thing", whether object or field, is equivalent to the set of information about that thing.

I do indeed take as an assumption that there is an objective reality, and I do suggest a basis for best describing that objective reality in the essay. However, I also discuss why we cannot have perfect knowledge of that objective reality in the model I propose, and thus I suggest a reconstructed theory in which we have both epistemic (subjective) and ontic (objective) layers. I argue in the essay that we must be absolutely clear on the epistemic/ontic boundary in any reconstructed theory, and I argue that reconstructing the objective mechanics on non-atomist and purely field-based lines will produce a better quantum ontology and better hope for the unification of quantum theory with gravity.

Thanks for the interesting discussion and thanks again for reading.

Mark

  • [deleted]

Joe,

Thanks for much for your generous comments.

Mark

  • [deleted]

Clearly, the abstract mathematical symbols 1 and 0 are opposite in nature and therefore attractive to contemplate. Indubitably, the symbolic mathematical symbols 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8, and 9 are sufficiently similar for them to abide. Unlike events in the real Universe that are always unique and new, mathematicians insist that all of the symbolic numbers are identical in value and appearance. Because of this logical misrepresentation, mathematicians cannot calculate the duration of real now and the extent of real here.

  • [deleted]

Mark,

I also thank you for presenting a logically deep argument, without resorting to mathematical shorthand, of which some of us are less than proficient.

While I agree atomism is conceptually limited, though in line with historical western object oriented assumptions, I wouldn't go so far as to do away with space and have problems with monism.

Space does provide us with the foundational conceptual parameters of absolute(inertia) and infinite. While we tend to prefer something physical to hang our hats on, that may be bias, but I'll try explaining myself better.

The logical conundrum of monism is that if we truly have one universal, indivisible state, then it would be neutral and thus zero, not one. In order to have this field express something, there has to be some inherent dichotomy; positive/negative, expansion/contraction, mass/energy, up/down, on/off, yes/no, conservative/liberal, etc. This then is dualism, of the Taoist variety, not monism.

In my entry, I make the argument that we are looking at time backward. It isn't the present moving along from past to future, which physics re-enforces by treating it as a measure from one event to the next, but is an emergent effect of action. That the changing configuration of what is, turns future into past. The earth doesn't travel the fourth dimension from yesterday to tomorrow. Tomorrow becomes yesterday because the earth rotates.

Duration is not a dimension external to the present moment, but is the state of the present between measured events.

When we try to impose an external, past to future timeline on action we go from a determined past to a probabilistic future and the result is multiworlds. The future is not deterministic because while the causal mechanism may be completely deterministic, the input cannot be known, as the lightcone of any event is not complete until the occurrence of the event.

This makes time an effect of action, similar to temperature. In fact, if we change the level of activity, as gravity and velocity do to quantum behavior, this affects the rate of change. Though rather than an accelerated clock rate causing the frame to move into the future quicker, it causes it to move into the past quicker, since it ages faster.

Which leaves just space as the background to action, not spacetime. Lacking any physical properties, space cannot be bent, or bound, thus it is both inert and infinite. Proof of inertia is centrifugal force, which is not due to the existence of some outside reference to determine spin, but only relates the spinning frame to an inertial state. Given that C is the speed at which all mass is converted to momentum, it would seem to be relative to this inertial state, since spacetime is only correlation of distance and duration, not a causal property.

The apparent cosmic expansion of space and contraction of gravitational spatial geometry are in inverse proportion, resulting in an overall flat space. The simplest explanation is some form of cosmic convection cycle of expanding energy and contracting mass. Light, then, on leaving its source, would expand like a gas and not remain a point particle. The absorption of light by mass is a multispectrum sample of this field, not a particular photon. So redshift is as much a property of light, as gravity is of mass, not a doppler effect of a receding source. I suspect gravity is not so much just a property of mass, but an effect of radiant energy condensing into and being absorbed by mass and lighter mass becoming more dense. When mass releases energy, it creates pressure, so logically the opposite process of energy condensing into mass would create a vacuum. The reason gravity waves cannot be detected is because we are looking in the wrong place. The energy released by fusion is light. Light is the gravity wave.

This then is two sides of a dualistic cycle.

While the present goes from past events to future ones and the events go from future to past, the underlaying dynamic is energy creating and consuming structure. The energy is what is present. Being dynamic, it is constantly changing form, thus creating and dissolving information. So energy goes past to future, while information goes future to past. Our bodies and brains, being physically extant, go past to future(while living), while our minds, as information processors, record these events streaming away into the past. Because energy is conserved, information is not. Even the destruction of information is information.

While the measure of time is a regular cycle, the effect of time is irregular action, otherwise there would be no arrow, just a constant repetition.

  • [deleted]

Mark

I think it is time to rehabilitate Parmenides

See my essay http://fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/1413

  • [deleted]

Mark,

Great essay! There are quite a few essays on here that have much in common. Have you read CM Hahn's essay? I very much agree with most of your essay, but I would point out an exception.

In 4.1.General relativity without atomism, you state "Interestingly, despite Einstein's inherent atomist bent, general relativity is not fundamentally an atomist theory and really needs no adaptation in order to remove atomism." which I would disagree with. The energy momentum tensor Tuv is based off of "particles" making up a perfect fluid. Thus one links Guv=Tuv with particles, however the cosmological constant magnitude is linked to quantum field theory and there is no mainstream way to make these two compatible. (Please check my essay to view how I think this can be accomplished) What I would state is more correct is to say that Riemannian geometry is not an atomist theory and really needs to adaptation.

Regards,

Jeff Baugher

  • [deleted]

Mark, thank you for the thoughtful reply. I just think that a world made of separate epistemic and ontic layers, like a world made up of atoms (or of advancing and retarded waves or what have you), is too complicated a fundamental description than it needs to be to account for observations. That is the key, I believe: What is the *simplest-case description* that can effectively account for observations and make the most useful predictions? I would bet that it isn't atoms, and it isn't dualism etc., but something that seems far more radical to our object-oriented tastes. I would also argue that just because a physical theory may share superficial traits with a vaguely developed and unsuccessful metaphysics of centuries past -- solipsism -- such resemblance should not, in and of itself, warrant its outright dismissal. (There has been some discussion regarding the solipsism question on my essay page.) Best of luck in the competition.

  • [deleted]

Mark

We belong the same confession http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagore

See http://vixra.org/abs/0907.0012

http://vixra.org/abs/0907.0014

fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/1413

Dear Mark,

A very good essay.

"we should require a field theory wherein the field is all that exists and wherein the field should define anything that we might call space rather than reside in a pre-existing space - a background independent field theory"

As we live in material world and matter is the only substance we know, I would like to add that the proposed field is formed by matter. A real material field (with definite form, structure and ability to act), filling space in its entirety can substitute for currently-used functional space (without form or structure but with ability to act).

Thanks,

Nainan

    Mark,

    Yes, the twin pillars GR and QM remain un-united as one or both are not true representations of nature. 聽You recognised that (and you have the courage to make very powerful statements) to criticise, in general, the ideas that emerge from the mainstream.

    I look upon your "physics without atomism" as an abstract placeholder for "physics with alternate explanation" and not as a physical world without atoms. This way, your essay becomes a valuable contribution. I just hope the others see it this way too.

    Regards and good luck

    Anton @ ( 聽/topic/1458 聽)

      • [deleted]

      Nainan,

      Thanks, for the comments. Your essay theme is indeed similar. Good luck to you.

      Mark

      • [deleted]

      Anton, thanks for reading and commenting.

      Actually though, I do see physics without atomism as a physical world without atoms (which are quite distinguishable from field quanta, which we can certainly allow). Not only that, I also see physics without atomism as a physical world without a physical space which exists without matter in it - that is, without space as either a "theater of operations" or as an actor in its own right (although we may certainly allow spaces in the mathematical rather than physical sense). It really is only an argument for a background independent field theory, which is not really very outrageous - GR is already such a thing.

      I think (at least I hope) that my essay explains clearly how physics, especially quantum theory and the process of unification, would benefit if we were to eliminate both localized particles and background physical space.

      To relate a little to the theme of your essay, I would say that I do not think is sensible to say that empty space has a geometry. Empty space is the absence of anything, and therefore of any characteristics. We cannot travel 1 light-year through empty space, spend a fortnight in empty space, nor scoop up 2 cubic meters of empty space, nor for that matter even identify a point in empty space. I can certainly agree with the theme of your essay that new physics might require both new physical laws and new geometries, however I would simply argue that those laws and geometries should describe a continuum - a field - rather than a localized particles and space which somehow exists and has properties, even a geometry, without anything in it.

      Best of luck and thanks again for commenting.

      Mark

      Dear Mark

      I quite agree with you that it is necessary to have an alternative to atomism. You think about a monistic field. Another idea is the Theory of Infinite Hierarchical Nesting of Matter as the matter of my Essay.

      Sergey Fedosin Essay

      • [deleted]

      That was an extremely great essay.

      16 days later

      Hello Mark Feeley,

      Thank you for your essay. You have raised a question others instinctively avoid. I agree with you! I too think the 'particle view' that currently dominates physical theory and intuition is at the heart of many of the paradoxes of physics. This is the 'mind set' that has interjected 'photons' and 'discrete quanta' into modern physics; going back to Planck and Einstein more than 100 years ago.

      In the Endnotes of my essay, "The Metaphysics of Physics", I present a simple derivation of Planck's Law of blackbody radiation using only continuous processes and not statistics. This derivation shows that Planck's Law is actually a mathematical tautology describing the interaction of energy. And not some physical law based on the existence of 'energy quanta'. Furthermore, at the same endnotes I give a mathematical proof of the proposition: "if the speed of light is constant, then light propagates as a wave". Thus showing the Photon Hypothesis of 'particles of light' is wrong!

      I think you will enjoy reading my essay. I look forward to any comments you may have on it.

      Best wishes,

      Constantinos

      7 days later
      • [deleted]

      Hi Mark,

      "... given the essay topic, all of the essays are highly speculative and focus on possibilities of an idea rather than its problems, ..."

      I speculate that there are possibly foundational mistakes to be found. This would of course include the option that you are right. When I decided to favor 1296, this was just a guess of mine.

      Regards,

      Eckard

      7 days later

      After studying about 250 essays in this contest, I realize now, how can I assess the level of each submitted work. Accordingly, I rated some essays, including yours.

      Cood luck.

      Sergey Fedosin

      If you do not understand why your rating dropped down. As I found ratings in the contest are calculated in the next way. Suppose your rating is [math]R_1 [/math] and [math]N_1 [/math] was the quantity of people which gave you ratings. Then you have [math]S_1=R_1 N_1 [/math] of points. After it anyone give you [math]dS [/math] of points so you have [math]S_2=S_1+ dS [/math] of points and [math]N_2=N_1+1 [/math] is the common quantity of the people which gave you ratings. At the same time you will have [math]S_2=R_2 N_2 [/math] of points. From here, if you want to be R2 > R1 there must be: [math]S_2/ N_2>S_1/ N_1 [/math] or [math] (S_1+ dS) / (N_1+1) >S_1/ N_1 [/math] or [math] dS >S_1/ N_1 =R_1[/math] In other words if you want to increase rating of anyone you must give him more points [math]dS [/math] then the participant`s rating [math]R_1 [/math] was at the moment you rated him. From here it is seen that in the contest are special rules for ratings. And from here there are misunderstanding of some participants what is happened with their ratings. Moreover since community ratings are hided some participants do not sure how increase ratings of others and gives them maximum 10 points. But in the case the scale from 1 to 10 of points do not work, and some essays are overestimated and some essays are drop down. In my opinion it is a bad problem with this Contest rating process. I hope the FQXI community will change the rating process.

      Sergey Fedosin

      Dear Mark,

      I enjoyed your essay! You have sound ideas, an excellent historical perspective, and a pleasing command of the English language. A few thoughts come to mind.

      1. The statement by Parmenides that you quote on page 2 might possibly be the earliest formulation of the principle of "background independence," which you cite on page 3. Thanks for pointing this out; I had no idea this concept went so far back! Background independence is crucial to understanding unification and quantum gravity (at least, in my opinion!)

      2. Coming from the math side, I can't resist pointing out that atomism and the continuum are only two of an uncountable number of different types of possible structures for modeling the physical world. Personally, I am bothered by some aspects of the continuum. What is a "continuum," after all? Well, it is a "linearly-ordered interpolative-complete set satisfying the least upper bound property." Sounds horrible, right? Personally, I think that two of these properties (interpolative completeness and the least upper bound property) have nothing to do with physics. Whenever I hear a physicist say "continuum or discrete?" I want to respond, "how about neither?"

      3. If you want to know what I would put in place of atomism or the continuum, I say, "cause and effect!" If you are interested, my essay attempts to describe how the universe might be built out of cause-and-effect relations. In light of your introduction, I am a bit trepidatious that you might consider some my ideas "absurd," but I draw comfort from the fact that neither of us included a single equation in the body of our texts, as you note for your essay on page 9. So much the better! The ideas come first, and the mathematics comes afterwards. My view is that the physical principles should be simple and clear, and that the mathematics should be whatever it has to be to get the job done.

      4. You point out that Making do without proper particles is not at all easy (page 8). Very true... I am still trying to figure out how to describe "particles" with causal structures.

      5. You say that "A non-atomist causal perspective would instead be that there are two boundary conditions imposed on the field by emission and absorption events, which create a quantization of the field between them." This, and the ensuing discussion, is interesting and requires more thought. The music analogy is a good one.

      Thanks for the great read! Take care,

      Ben Dribus

        • [deleted]

        Ben,

        Thanks a lot for the comments and good luck as you go forward.

        With regards to your 2nd and 5th comments especially:

        I think that the cause-effect picture and a continuum field picture are extremely closely connected. Before I wrote the essay I actually considered focusing the essay on the relationship between "events" and a continuum, but decided that some rationale for the continuum picture needed to be presented first.

        I actually think that instead of neither continuum nor discrete, the answer is really more like both. This is essentially the idea that you refer to on in your 5th comment. If we consider both cause and effect to be "events", then causes and effects are necessarily countable or discrete entities. Conceptually however, an event picture requires two types of entities: events and connections between events. The follow-up question then is what is the nature of connections, and I have suggested that the connection between is a physical field, which we can indeed define in a background independent way. The relationship is even deeper though, and as I describe, suitably defined events can act as boundary conditions on the field and thus induce quantization effects in the field (in a quite classical way). Thus the cause-effect picture (what I would call the event picture) and a field picture are intimately and almost recursively connected. Both seem valid and necessary. I think it is a little easier to think of the field as more physical or "real" and the events as more abstract, but I admit this might really be nothing more than a naming convention or some sort of vague "realist" bias on my part.

        Cheers and good luck, Mark