Hi Alex,

Nice to see you too. It is very interesting that you can modelize Young slit experiment using jellyfish and expanders. Do you get interference at the detectors?

As we discussed together in Bloomington, your simple yet poweful algorithm may be used on my model for fermion propagation involving participation of a team of bosons, mainly higgs bosons, around the fermion, interacting together to give (at a higher scale) a mass and a velocity independant of lattice directions. That gives a program of think experiment on my hyperdiamond network with elementary fermions and bosons grouped as jellyfish, but it will be very computation intensive. Since them, I finished defining the precise structure of each particle. I still have to work on how to encode velocity, because I have some but not a unique choice.

Cheers,

Ray

Hi Alan,

Reading your essay I see that you have feeling that the topology of universe is not an infinite euclidean space, and you are intensively searching which is the real topology. We both share a good reference on universe topology: "The Wraparound Universe", your reference [4], is the same of my reference [14], "L'univers chiffonné", from Jean-Pierre Luminet, original french version translated as Wraparound Universe.

The metric of the universe, our way to measure if our space is curved or flat, convex or hyperbolic, and how many dimension it has, is in my model only an emergent property. The final under-metric topology is a trivalent network, where nodes dont needs to have coordinates.

A local topology of immediate neighborood appears with hypersphere S3 topology, but discretized to the 24-cell polytope (having 24 vertices regularly placed on a S3 hypersphere). This explains the particles we have, their symmetries, linked to quantum physics, and directly points to 240 E8 roots as 8 dim quantum numbers of Garrett Lisi's TOE. This, with its internal structure and encoded data, plays the role of Calabi-Yau variety in string theory. A higher scale topology emerges when gluing together all this "supernodes" as a regular lattice, the four dimensional F4, a sublattice of the trivial 4 dim integer lattice. Because it is also a network, the most natural emergent topology is to glue together opposite faces, so it becomes finite and closed but without any center or boundary, and get a T4 (four dimensional tore) topology. I will later explore your concept of Archimede screw and put a post on your wall. All the best,

Ray

Hi Tom,

Yes I was not aware of the Sophie Germain's primes (p=6k-1) and "safe primes" (p=12k-1) that you mention in your paper. They are maybe some relations with the numbers which emerges from the 24-cell symmetry in my essay and are often multiple of 12, like 24,48,72,144,240...

The "24" lecture of John Baez which is my last and 24th reference gives a lot of other emergent presence of this number in exceptional mathematics, but also in concrete physics. The Holy Bible is also full of references to 24. Even if we are not making numerology here, that fact may have a sense.

And back to Sophie Germain numbers, 23 got a movie, having too a lot of hidden sense.

So 24 open many doors to metaphysic.

But finally what gives real interest to my theory is that, 1) it is impossible to find a simplest component than a set element, 2) it is impossible to find a simplest structure than a trivalent network for buildind a space 3) the reality finally emerges as all the known particles 4) general relativity emerges too through loop quantum gravity

My goal is to explain physics not only with a model but with a concept which can be the reality itself (the trivalent network), so that physics can expand to metaphysics.

All the best,

Ray

  • [deleted]

Nature of the Universe is discrete.

http://www.fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/946

    Hi Yuri,

    We agree, nature of the Universe is discrete. And I guess that here in this Forum we are a majority, but maybe not outside the forum.

    I too agree with your essay's focus on the 3:1 ratio importance.

    For some examples I think that the explanation is just in the quaternion nature.

    1 real part and 3 imaginaries.

    And because quaternion algebra is the highest dimensional associative division algebra, we get this ratio at key positions in nature.

    (But to completely understand it we have to finish with non associative octonions)

    Quaternions is the best scientific discovery, thanks to Lord Hamilton.

    Maxwell equations were written with quaternions.

    My Nvidia graphics card computes faster using quaternions.

    We get one lepton and three quarks in each family.

    Best regards

    Ray

    • [deleted]

    Well , first of all hello dear manager,

    Interesting strategy but about sciences and realism ...Nada .I invite you to learn the foundamentals and our rationalities, you know it exists many good books about our equations and ITS INTERNATIONAL LANGUAGE.

    I invite you to insert a good SOA and a good sorting of your algorythms.MBA you say , I am seeing!

    Well to your boss and chiefs at IBM, he searches in the bad road .....thus of couse you must rethought some things.A big joke your mixings and ironical pseudo sciences what is this circus.Frankly ,let's be serious a little.You know the Occham Razor and hop all is easier.It is true what, you think what , that watson lab is going to search these ironics extradimensions of nothing for nothing.

    Regards

    Steve

    Really ironic

    • [deleted]

    Hi Ray,

    I briefly skimmed your essay, but admit that I need to study it closely. I like to study all models that are this similar to Lisi's.

    Some questions come to mind:

    1) How do we build-up this model from the 48 outcome possibilities of Figure 10a to the 240 roots of E8? My models expect a 5-fold "pentality" symmetry (such as may arise from a 4-D Pentachoron basis) to provide the origin of fermionic mass.

    2) Could the "sixth element" be tachyons? I expect tachyons to be involved in the origin of mass.

    3) Lawrence Crowell and I think that TOE may be a SUSY E8xE8*~SO(32). Lubos Motl challenges the validity of an E8 TOE because it doesn't have complex representations, but SO(32) does...

    If you get a chance, I would appreciate your opinion of my essay @ #816.

    Have Fun!

    Dr. Cosmic Ray

      • [deleted]

      ahahaha you are also in this pseudo strategy of Ex for what ....a prize.

      Good luck aftr all you have a chance as you are very skilling in business strategy....please HARVARD LAW WHERE ARE YOU ?????

      HIHIIH LET4S GO THUS.

      DEAR ALL DON4T CONFOUND THE REAL MODEL WITH THE FALSES SIMILARITIES PLEASE?

      To you

      Steve

      • [deleted]

      and now John Baez in the team and also he is from supelec I suppose.No But frankly! You make sciences or what????

      ps The higgs do not exist but frankly , what are your courses in physics at universities.It is time to learn your foundamentals.

      First the Higgs has an external cause of mass,thus of course that doens't respect our standrard model and its newtonian fractalization of mass and correlated fields.

      I think you confound the computing with the reality and of course we understand thus why you bad superimpose your laws and methods ....You confound the business and the sciences, you confound the rationalism with the illogism.You confound the research of truths and truth with a pseudo research of nothing for nothing.

      Furthermore a string is not foundamental and of course we understand thus why you confound all, probably due to some nodes and bad habits.

      Strings, multiverses, and higgs and tachyons and ...all that is..an ocean of stupidities and ironies for the rational part of the sciences community.And be sure they exist.

      Regards

      Steve

      • [deleted]

      they compute faster...what they accelerate it's that ahahah because you insert quaternionic algorythms, it is that,it's

      The best discovery yes and me I am the queen of England.No but frankly it's just a tool.We dream in live.What are you saying there.

      you must rethought your method of approximation.In fact you confound really the things.

      A tetrahedron quaternionic and 3 imaginaries and 1 real...no but frankly already that te tetrahedron is not foundamental four our entanglement, already that the time is not a vector in this tetrahedrom...and now the quaternion who says to the octonion that galois and lie are friends perhaps also....where are your foundamentals????

      That lacks of realsim all that.and of course we have infinie dimensions and opur universe is infinite as our expansion also....no but frankly.

      Steve

      p.s. - Ray - I thought that E8 implied Octonion algebra, which is equivalent to a Real Quaternion "twisted together" with an Imaginary Quaternion.

      Have Fun!

      Dr. Cosmic Ray

      • [deleted]

      HIHIHI LET S GO FOR A REVOLUTION OF A CRAZZY BELGIAN pay attention at this momment I don't take my meds,thus don't be offensed of course ,thus we know the team now Th , Ray 1,Ray2,Lisi...they like the Rays.Lubos and Lawrence..Yuri no don't say me you are with them with Mr Baez.hihihi let's have fun...hihihi Dr cosmic Ray, revolution.let's go for a comportment of paranoiac baby

      Oh lalalala the poor thinkers.....Lubos is a comic in fact and they just make pub for something which is already finished.If them they are rationals , me I am still the queen of England.Oh lalala this sad papper which governs our lifes, the monney is like the vanity, an error.

      In fact it exists How many rationalists on this Earth frankly?? How many people knows the real meaning of the relativity.Frankly it is bizare.And the most impressing is the fact that you insist as if you were right.As if you were real scientists.And you repeat still and always your stupidities ,and you are happy furthermore,it's ironic to see pseudos scientists affirming that they know sciences,It is not possible when I see your conclusions and visions of our objectivity.A real wind, a real joke...a false friendship, a false patriotism...just a band of frustrated by lack of recognizing, that's all.I am not crazzy it is God who says me that, he says me , Steve Pay attention and don't hesitate to be direct because unfortunally the human nature is young and makes errors.

      Begium 150 USA CANADA NETHERLANDS 0

      Steve

      • [deleted]

      ahahahaha as that you shall say , you are seeing all "Steve when we speak of quatern and octo and lie ande Ex ...he reacts immediately ahahahaha interesting .they want to destabilize me,hihiih

      Friendly crazzy thinkers

      Steve

      • [deleted]

      You right, Ray!

      The discrete physics has many opponents

      http://motls.blogspot.com/2005/11/discrete-physics.html

        • [deleted]

        amen !

        17 days later

        Hi Dr. Cosmic Ray

        Thank you for reading and for asking very pertinent questions.

        For your first question, a very important one: how comes E8 from D4, as lattices ?

        The answer is illustrated by Figure 4b

        You see here a fermion (in Lisi's base) from one family, encoded by two triplets of bits:

        One gives a number in 0-7 to select one of 8 out-coming short links (of length 2),

        The other selects one of the 8 out-coming long links (of length 2*square(2)). A long links is (1+i)*the short link, when each of 24 external leaves is connected through a short and a long links to external leaves of neighbor modules. So we encode here 64 fermions by 64 E8 roots.

        Just by rotating the diagram (the three central bits) by 1/3 and 2/3 of circle you get two other families. (thats what I call 'elegance')

        Triality reduces to 1/3 circle rotation, and 1/2(-1+i+j+k) quaternionic product.

        Now you have 192 of 240 roots, corresponding to fermions of standard model.

        So E8 lattice is twice projected to D4, one of the projection being "twisted" as you said.

        This twisting is the (1+i) quaternionic multiplication, and geometrically is two 45° rotations in two perpendicular planes and one square(2) scaling

        One D4 is the gluonic part of the fermion

        The other is the higgsonic. (in [math]\left\{ \frac{1}{4}\omega _L^3, \frac{1}{4}\omega _R^3,\frac{1}{2} W^3,\frac{1}{2} B_{1 }^3\right\}[/math] root system)

        Positive weak force boson W+ has quantum coordinates {0,0,+2,0}, represented by quaternion 2j , and its opposite, -2j, for its anti-boson W-.

        Left chiral (self-dual) part of the spin connection is represented by 2. Right chiral (anti self-dual) part is represented by 2i.

        The 16 hypercubic vertices of the radius 2 24-cell, with coordinates ,each +1 or -1 are 16 frame-higgs bosons, therefore we name this sector "higgsonic".

        On this basis, fermions coordinates are permutations of {2a,2b,0,0} where a and b are 1 or -1.

        Due to the fact that the sixth element, the icositetrachoron (or 24-cell) is self dual, both D4 merges in the same lattice.

        For your second question, my sixth element is not a tachyon because it is only the geometric structure of the proto-space as a 4D crystal.

        The structure (as a trivalent subgraph) of a cell of empty space at Planck scale, illustrated in Fig 4a, is the cell of this crystal, and hold symmetries and geometry of the sixth element, the 24-cell.

        As you explain in your paper how fermion are vertices of a direct lattice and bosons are struts of the dual lattice, my hyperdiamond lattice represent F4 lattice and its dual (itseff) in same lattice, because of self duality of 24-cell (with a square(2) factor between both). Then the figure has one more step of complexity. Two half-fermions are symmetrically encoded with bosonic part in the dual. So we have bosonic higgsonic sector, and bosonic gluonic sector in its dua. And fermionic has two halves (of the E8 representation), one in dual of bosonic higgsonic sector, and the second half in dual of bosonic gluonic sector.

        By this innovative way of thinking, my theory escapes to mathematical issue which were found by Jacques Distler in Lisi's theory.

        My model allow an explicit construction of the LQG gravitationnal field (the tetrad), as a field of four quaternions which values are implicitly encoded by the local topology.

        The connection and the metric tensor both derives from the tetrad (and its derivatives, that can be defined along the supporting spin network, whom nodes are getting a 4D position field also implicitly defined)

        In this context, E8 may be enough, and no need to go to E8xE8...

        Its difficult to explain all my theory in a 10 pages paper, and I m working on a more extensive demonstration.

        All the best,

        Ray

        Hi Steve,

        A man who love spheres can not be totally bad. You suppose more facts than me. Its my method: minimize hypothesis. I just suppose that information is real and more elementary than matter and forces in our real world. Then, the best tool to modelize our world from this basis is set theory, the ultimate simple math. And topology and graph theory are used just after, in a way that even a non scientist can understand, to generate a spin network encoding information. I prove that this information encodes also the gravitational field of Quantum Gravity as a "Tetrad" implicit field, and the extended standard model from 24-cell symmetry. If my universe is not based on spheres, its based on its best discrete approximation, the 24 cell. You understand why spheres I like are S0,S1,S3 and S7 ?

        I searched for your paper on spherization but didnt find it anywhere.

        All the best

        Ray

        • [deleted]

        still computing, any real physical sense.

        Pay attention dear all rationalists, they are going to invent a time machine with tachyons because they have received a Higgs information of pseudo gravity which turns, a string which turns also and of course a tensor with infinities there and after a kind of super extradimensions for travel in time, indeed we must return at home.Extradimensions no but frankly and what after a BH is a door between periods also at all scales , no but frankly.It is not sciences that but sciences fiction, sorry, just sciences fiction, a kind of sciences for non scientists.A kind of pseudo extrapolations becoming of confusions, numerous, be sure.No but frankly , I must say you that we have our universal laws , irreversibilities, constants,....and these foundamentals are rational, deterministic and logic at all scales in 3D. i AM SORRY BUT YOU DO NOT RESPECT THE ENTROPY, ITS DISTRIBUTION IN COOLING, YOU CONFOUND THE PHYSICALITY AND YOUR IRRATONALITIES.You must really buy better books, they exist!I invite you to read and learn even the works of Ecard about the pure rationality, but perhaps you prefer infinite cantor sets without real sense......our physicality is deterministic dear thinkers and in 3D.

        R Q ....C ....please use correctly the distribution of numbers inside the physicality.

        FOCUS ON RATIONALITIES IF IT IS POSSIBLE please ...the sciences must be precisce, exact !!!

        Steve

        • [deleted]

        Dear Ray,

        Thank you for explaining your ideas. You really have looked closely into the geometrical aspect of an E8 TOE.

        Your analysis includes complex numbers, but a single E8 has strictly real representations. Lubos Motl "beat me up" over this point (and a TOE needs complex numbers to explain CP symmetry violation). As such, I don't think that a "normal" E8 is good enough, but rather we should look at an H4xH4* (where the fermions should be in a single 120-plet so we don't have 192 fermionic degrees-of-freedom) or an E8xE8*~SO(32) (which now has 240 fermionic degrees-of-freedom - enough for a 3-fold triality generational symmetry, a 4-fold quartality color symmetry, a 5-fold pentality "handedness" symmetry that I previously described (not the 4-fold symmetry that you described - After discussions with Lubos Motl (Jacques Distler hasn't commented on my ideas lately - years ago I attended Physics grad school at the University of Texas at Austin, and would have hoped that Distler would at least give a serious comment), I'm convinced that the right-handed neutrino is a problem in Lisi's model), a 2-fold up-down symmetry, and a 2-fold matter-antimatter symmetry.

        I think that SO(32)~E8xE8* is beautiful because fermions and bosons are allowed to exist in dual (reciprocal) lattices, one E8 is strictly real and is "twisted together" with the second strictly imaginary E8*, and SO(32) allows the complex representations needed for CP symmetry violation.

        I know that Lisi was worried about "ghost" states, but I think that he incorrectly defined them, and forced bosons in the same representation as fermions. My "tachyons" have a spin of 1/2 in the 8-D Gosset lattice representation, but only a 0 spin projection into our 4-D of spacetime.

        E8xE8* also solves a framing problem via the Haag-Lopuszanski-Sohnius theorem.

        Good Luck in the contest & Have Fun!

        Dr. Cosmic Ray

        • [deleted]

        In this condition, if my posts are derleted, I stop to discuss with you.

        I said I am good and my faith is very very big, hope you also you dislike the bad, personally I eat it at my breakfast, and even if I am dead i WILL CONTINUE AGAINST THE BAD.....thus what is the problem???

        Answer anywhere........the real secret is the universal faith my friend.And a work is a work of all a life....not a short work of nothing.On that delete if you want it's not my problem.

        Now I am going to pray for you a little, perhaps you shall see spheres, real and rational.

        Steve